Road to Cuckold
- Thread starter nobodysrage
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It is almost impossible to diagnosis with a high degree of certainty a non-celebrity from just a few posts. I will say though that many of the conversations you have relayed lay out exactly what I have seen in other Covert Narcissistic women.
- During the initial phase of your relationship you got lots of "your the greatest" etc. great sex all the time, you really enjoyed this time from your writing.
- Previously she played along with your fantasy, watching porn and discussing it with you and never said a blanket no and even spoke positively sometimes.
- You are at 2 years in your relationship, so you would be on the far side of a fairly long Golden Period, if she is a Narcissist.
- If she is a Narcissist things would be changing at some point within this timeframe and things are changing.
- Now specifically regarding your sexual desire for MFM 3some which she knows is your number 1 sexual fantasy she is saying no.
- She would be lying if she is a Narcissist which she has done multiple times.
- She would have other men hanging around which is happening and she would cheat which you suspect she is doing (I agree with your gut instinct).
- Overall there friction now, where before there was no friction or disagreement and that change in mood is from her behavior not from you.
- Your conversations close to a Narcissistic relationship I was involved in before I knew about Covert Narcissism and why I learned about it.
I have heard nothing about anything you have done that would be cause for her to change her attitude towards you. All of the sudden now there are disagreements, which all center around her behavior, not yours. Have you done anything like seen an old girlfriend, or had lunch with one, or anything? I didn't read anything about you doing anything like that. Let us know if you did something that you shouldn't have done, but right now the only person of the two of you in your relationship that has done things which violated boundaries is her. She continues to violate boundaries of your relationship even after getting called out on them. It doesn't sound like she is even sorry, but regardless even if she has apologized, she continues on to repeat it again. From your recounting of the conversations she seems to feel entitled and is taking you for granted. What I hear and put together from your posts is that you are committed to the relationship and she is expressing indifference, by lying to you, cheating on you probably and triangulating you with these other guys. Narcissists enjoy having this type of interaction which is a form of punishment of you for some perceived failure by being indifferent, making you out to be unreasonable, lying to you, cheating on you, etc. She loves that you are checking up on her.
You don't love this girl, you are addicted to her. This is what Narcissists do, they make you crazy. I mean ask yourself if you really want to be in a relationship, especially a sharing relationship involving MFM 3somes that you are checking up on all the time. How does it feel overall? Is distracting and taking up your focus for you day wondering if she is cheating and trying to figure out how to keep track of her. You have got yourself a Trauma Bond is my suspicion.
She is using your desire for watching her with another man as something she can deny you to control you, then occasionally giving you hope with a slight "Future Fake" of maybe I will do it. This is classic Narcissistic drama, be jealous of me, triangulating you with other men, withhold what you want sexually, that I have seen before. I recommend studying up on the subject so you can keep watching her behavior to see if it continues to fit Narcissistic manipulations and traits.
Probably the biggest things that throw it into the Narcissist column are; 1. You haven't done anything to warrant the change in behavior 2. You don't trust her by your own admission. Do you really want to be in a relationship with a woman you can't trust, especially a sharing relationship which challenges your feelings of security in a relationship. My personal opinion is to get rid of her. You will feel better without her drama and triangulation. Remember for a stand-up guy like you who isn't a cheater having a lousy girlfriend prevents you from finding a good woman who will love and you can trust. They are out there. Take it from an old guy who has enjoyed many great years in the Lifestyle. almost longer than you have been alive. Lifestyle relationships are fantastic IF you have a good partner that is committed to you and trustworthy. That isn't this girl. I don't believe she'll ever do it anyway at this point for the reasons I have outlined. You will continue to be frustrated, she will continue to lie and cheat, be deceptive making you wonder and in the end you will be discarded without any remorse. I say beat her to the punch which will be much better for your dignity and feelings of self-worth that you ended it because she wasn't a good enough woman for you. Which is absolutely true. My mantra is if you don't believe you can trust, you can't so you get rid of them.
- During the initial phase of your relationship you got lots of "your the greatest" etc. great sex all the time, you really enjoyed this time from your writing.
- Previously she played along with your fantasy, watching porn and discussing it with you and never said a blanket no and even spoke positively sometimes.
- You are at 2 years in your relationship, so you would be on the far side of a fairly long Golden Period, if she is a Narcissist.
- If she is a Narcissist things would be changing at some point within this timeframe and things are changing.
- Now specifically regarding your sexual desire for MFM 3some which she knows is your number 1 sexual fantasy she is saying no.
- She would be lying if she is a Narcissist which she has done multiple times.
- She would have other men hanging around which is happening and she would cheat which you suspect she is doing (I agree with your gut instinct).
- Overall there friction now, where before there was no friction or disagreement and that change in mood is from her behavior not from you.
- Your conversations close to a Narcissistic relationship I was involved in before I knew about Covert Narcissism and why I learned about it.
I have heard nothing about anything you have done that would be cause for her to change her attitude towards you. All of the sudden now there are disagreements, which all center around her behavior, not yours. Have you done anything like seen an old girlfriend, or had lunch with one, or anything? I didn't read anything about you doing anything like that. Let us know if you did something that you shouldn't have done, but right now the only person of the two of you in your relationship that has done things which violated boundaries is her. She continues to violate boundaries of your relationship even after getting called out on them. It doesn't sound like she is even sorry, but regardless even if she has apologized, she continues on to repeat it again. From your recounting of the conversations she seems to feel entitled and is taking you for granted. What I hear and put together from your posts is that you are committed to the relationship and she is expressing indifference, by lying to you, cheating on you probably and triangulating you with these other guys. Narcissists enjoy having this type of interaction which is a form of punishment of you for some perceived failure by being indifferent, making you out to be unreasonable, lying to you, cheating on you, etc. She loves that you are checking up on her.
You don't love this girl, you are addicted to her. This is what Narcissists do, they make you crazy. I mean ask yourself if you really want to be in a relationship, especially a sharing relationship involving MFM 3somes that you are checking up on all the time. How does it feel overall? Is distracting and taking up your focus for you day wondering if she is cheating and trying to figure out how to keep track of her. You have got yourself a Trauma Bond is my suspicion.
She is using your desire for watching her with another man as something she can deny you to control you, then occasionally giving you hope with a slight "Future Fake" of maybe I will do it. This is classic Narcissistic drama, be jealous of me, triangulating you with other men, withhold what you want sexually, that I have seen before. I recommend studying up on the subject so you can keep watching her behavior to see if it continues to fit Narcissistic manipulations and traits.
Probably the biggest things that throw it into the Narcissist column are; 1. You haven't done anything to warrant the change in behavior 2. You don't trust her by your own admission. Do you really want to be in a relationship with a woman you can't trust, especially a sharing relationship which challenges your feelings of security in a relationship. My personal opinion is to get rid of her. You will feel better without her drama and triangulation. Remember for a stand-up guy like you who isn't a cheater having a lousy girlfriend prevents you from finding a good woman who will love and you can trust. They are out there. Take it from an old guy who has enjoyed many great years in the Lifestyle. almost longer than you have been alive. Lifestyle relationships are fantastic IF you have a good partner that is committed to you and trustworthy. That isn't this girl. I don't believe she'll ever do it anyway at this point for the reasons I have outlined. You will continue to be frustrated, she will continue to lie and cheat, be deceptive making you wonder and in the end you will be discarded without any remorse. I say beat her to the punch which will be much better for your dignity and feelings of self-worth that you ended it because she wasn't a good enough woman for you. Which is absolutely true. My mantra is if you don't believe you can trust, you can't so you get rid of them.
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I hope you will take this to heart, because I'm on your side even if I'm recommending breaking up with her, which is a place you haven't gotten to yet. Hence, why I wrote my first post, describing the condition and the destructive nature of these relationships. My next post summarized what has gone on in your relationship trying to get you to recognize that her mood has changed without any obvious reasoning plus she is continuously being dishonest. By your own words you are describing your attempt to get her to change back to where your relationship was before (Golden Period) which is the exact Trauma Bond dynamic I mentioned in my first post. You are trying to convince her of how great your relationship was before and that it is her behavior now which is screwing things up, so she needs to change her behavior so you get back to the Golden Period. She doesn't want to go back, but rather is enjoying toying with your emotions with devaluing treatment. My assumption from my analysis of her is that you are firmly in the Sustained Devaluation period. She knows you are upset about this situation which she is enjoying the powerful feelings that treating you badly gives her (pretty fucked I know). Whereas previously in the Golden Period your attention and compliments, etc. were Fuel to her, but now your Fuel is getting boring and stale. Time to mix it up and get some negative Fuel from the feeling of power she gets from emotionally fucking with you. Sounds hard believe, but this is exactly what I think you have going on with her.
I know you had vision of hot MFM with this girl loving and thinking you were perfect, but that was an illusion manufactured by her to ensnare you. The woman in front of you now is almost the real person. The real person doesn't show up until discard phase and they are some ugly people on the inside.
Trust me when I say this I feel your pain, because I was in one of these relationships devoted to her being a nice loving guy, but all the sudden this "Mood Change" showed up in her. I vacillated between frustrated trying not to be angry at her for violations of boundaries and other times trying to convince how great a guy I was trying to get to change her attitude and behavior so we could get back to that fun relationship we had previously. We never went back there and my treatment and her behavior just got worse with an occasional 1 day or even less respite period before I went right back to negative treatment.
This how it works for Narcissists. I have observed this dynamic in other relationships of people I know in the lifestyle and vanilla life after I learned about it. I have dumped quite a few women, quickly these days, when I see the behavior. There are a lot of them out there single. I believe that Narcissists are a larger percentage of the dating pool than they are of the population at large, because Narcissists always end up destroying their relationships every few years so they make a return to dating, whereas the good men and women have a better chance of forming strong long-term relationships so they are removed from the dating pool.
I hope it helps you get to the place you are going to eventually get to, because regardless of what label you give her she isn't a good woman. She lies, she cheats, she Future Fakes you, and I'm almost certain you have more coming and it will be much more painful for regarding your feelings and emotions. When these more painful actions by her occur you will be alone wondering how this wonderful woman could these things to you. I wouldn't be surprised if she cheats on you by having a 3some with 2 other guys, but won't do it with you. That is the kind of things that happen with these horrible people. When finally get to the point of leaving you won't recognize yourself and it will take you some time to get back to yourself. Once you do you wonder how you could allow it to happen to you and why you didn't recognize it earlier.
Good luck to you man.
I know you had vision of hot MFM with this girl loving and thinking you were perfect, but that was an illusion manufactured by her to ensnare you. The woman in front of you now is almost the real person. The real person doesn't show up until discard phase and they are some ugly people on the inside.
Trust me when I say this I feel your pain, because I was in one of these relationships devoted to her being a nice loving guy, but all the sudden this "Mood Change" showed up in her. I vacillated between frustrated trying not to be angry at her for violations of boundaries and other times trying to convince how great a guy I was trying to get to change her attitude and behavior so we could get back to that fun relationship we had previously. We never went back there and my treatment and her behavior just got worse with an occasional 1 day or even less respite period before I went right back to negative treatment.
This how it works for Narcissists. I have observed this dynamic in other relationships of people I know in the lifestyle and vanilla life after I learned about it. I have dumped quite a few women, quickly these days, when I see the behavior. There are a lot of them out there single. I believe that Narcissists are a larger percentage of the dating pool than they are of the population at large, because Narcissists always end up destroying their relationships every few years so they make a return to dating, whereas the good men and women have a better chance of forming strong long-term relationships so they are removed from the dating pool.
I hope it helps you get to the place you are going to eventually get to, because regardless of what label you give her she isn't a good woman. She lies, she cheats, she Future Fakes you, and I'm almost certain you have more coming and it will be much more painful for regarding your feelings and emotions. When these more painful actions by her occur you will be alone wondering how this wonderful woman could these things to you. I wouldn't be surprised if she cheats on you by having a 3some with 2 other guys, but won't do it with you. That is the kind of things that happen with these horrible people. When finally get to the point of leaving you won't recognize yourself and it will take you some time to get back to yourself. Once you do you wonder how you could allow it to happen to you and why you didn't recognize it earlier.
Good luck to you man.
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That sound pretty much more tragic than it really is.
Anyways I will get into the topic a bit. Thanks for it!
Well I should have mentioned that. I have a great contact with my ex as well. I meet her often. There was a time when she was still after me (Still I was clear for me never to go back). In our first months I fucked a lot of other girls when weren't officially together. There were situations when a neighbor of me called her with another name "You must be Sandy from last Sunday". There were a lot of clues she was aware what was going on. She never raised her voice. We didn't have one single struggle in 2 years. I cant even remember a single thing she didn't accept in that 2 years. Honestly. The relationship is 100 % harmonic.
Believe me when I say I am not. I am the one who is in the lead. I could finish it without looking back. I know it might sound arrogant, but I am aware I would have plenty of options.
Anyways I will get into the topic a bit. Thanks for it!
Sounds just like the guy I was before I got involved with my Narcissist. I was very surprised when I turned up with this weird feeling which turned out to be a Trauma Bond. Fortunately have high self-esteem and somewhat lower empathy so I was about to bounce back. I am back to that guy I was before, but much wiser with better understanding of my true value. I don't put up with that treatment anymore. I also can recognize their phony "Golden Period" plays which signals me to put my walls up, plus starting to date other women, and just go along for the ride knowing that soon I will be dumping them when their mood changes.
I did post 2 in a row, so I hope you will read the post right above your last post if you missed it.
I don't have enough information to make an accurate assessment with any confidence level. I will say though your posts included paraphrased conversations that sounded very familiar to me and then the actions you mentioned as well. I just like to make people aware of their type because they are sneaky and vicious.
I hope it works out for you.
I hope it works out for you.
I'm not sure she's a narcissist - she doesn't appear to be lying to inflate herself. She seems more unable to accept the rejection of being "not good enough" for her ex-boyfriend and continues to visit him seeking to understand why or win him back. She then lies because, deep down, she knows what she is doing is wrong, doesn't want to hurt you and probably feels guilty but can't help herself from continuing to revisit the past. I mean, you paint her to be the perfect person but she obviously has something going on if she's continually seeing an ex and not only lying to you about it but lying to him about you. Honestly, the latter seems more concerning, since it suggests she doesn't want to risk damaging any potential option to get back together with him (although maybe he'd actually be more interested if he knew she was in a relationship).
Ultimately though, it may not matter. You said you only met two years ago and it may be that she just needs a bit more time to sort out the old relationship and move on. If the past relationship was a long-term one, it will probably take a number of years for her to really move on. Getting jealous and angry about it, it probably not going to do you any favors, and you are probably handling things in the best way.
The one thing you might do is just say "Look, I feel pretty certain you have been visiting your ex-boyfriend. If you feel like there are things left unsaid that you need to work through, I'm okay with that as long as you're honest about it. I'll always support you, just please don't lie to me."
Ultimately though, it may not matter. You said you only met two years ago and it may be that she just needs a bit more time to sort out the old relationship and move on. If the past relationship was a long-term one, it will probably take a number of years for her to really move on. Getting jealous and angry about it, it probably not going to do you any favors, and you are probably handling things in the best way.
The one thing you might do is just say "Look, I feel pretty certain you have been visiting your ex-boyfriend. If you feel like there are things left unsaid that you need to work through, I'm okay with that as long as you're honest about it. I'll always support you, just please don't lie to me."
Wow, that's super hot - I wish I could experience something like that with my wife but we don't seem to have any good clubs around here and it is impossible to do currently on vacation with kids.
It sounds like your girlfriend is probably suffering from a little guilt or shame and just needs positive support to build good feelings about what happened and to be receptive to future experiences.
Also, that's awesome things seem to be resolved with the ex and your relationship has improved.
You both need total.open communication total.honesrty if you dont it wll.not work.amd cause more problems
Thats great feel.free to ask me anything since we started this it has been rewarding for both of us she gets to.play and our sex life has gotten even bettrg4